SPN

[hils]

Ok, first of all am I the only one amused that Dean now calls Castiel 'Cass'. Hee!

I'm actually quite surprised Sam and Dean had this discussion so soon, although I'm sure it's far from over. I thought they'd have Sam being all covert for a bit longer. I dunno.

Anyway, this episode definitely had the squick factor. I'm glad I wasn't eating while I watched it. LOL!

I wonder where things are going to go from here. That barrier is between the boys now and I suspect it will be there for a long time to come. Sam says he's decided not to use his powers any more, and I'm not sure I believe him. I certainly think Ruby will have a thing or two to say about it.

The more I think about it the more suspicious I am about Castiel. I think there's more to him than just a plain old Angel of the Lord.

We shall see...

I need a Sam icon now he's hot. I did promise stir_of_echoes I would make some. Maybe tomorrow

Comments

[selinamoonfire.livejournal.com]

I'm suspicious of Castiel too. I'm not sure why, but I just don't trust him.

I think for now Sam is going to try to be good and not use his powers, but I think he's still going to wonder why it's bad to use them if he's helping people. Other than God says that it's a bad idea (and how do we REALLY know that is what God wants?) Again, that whole mistrust of Castiel issue.

Can we get rid of Ruby? I don't like this latest incarnation of her. I was kinda hoping Dean would use the knife on her, but nope. Not yet.

Yes! You must make SpN icons. Ones that you will share so we can spread the hotness of the Winchesters all over LJ.

[hils.livejournal.com]

Heh! Oh, I bet there's all sorts of wank in the SPN fandom about Dean calling Ruby a bitch and pushing her around again

[selinamoonfire.livejournal.com]

I haven't seen any wank about the pushing...yet. I've seen a lot of complaining about the fans not liking the actress' portrayal of Ruby.

[hils.livejournal.com]

My housemate was saying last year that there was a whole faction of the SPN fandom calling Dean a misogynist

[selinamoonfire.livejournal.com]

Yep. It was a big freak out. I stayed out of it as much as possible.

[hils.livejournal.com]

I bet this episode starts it all up again

[selinamoonfire.livejournal.com]

Probably. LOL Though I think the bigger freak out will be "OMG was Sam having sex Ruby?"

[hils.livejournal.com]

Uh, no!

Discussion over ;)

[selinamoonfire.livejournal.com]

LOL!

Better than some other things that could be implied. ;)

[hils.livejournal.com]

Well, that's true

I'm so glad I'm not in the SPN fandom. I'm sure I'd have flamed someone by now if I was

[selinamoonfire.livejournal.com]

I just keep my head down, keep typing, and friend people that seem like they're not involved in the drama. I'm hoping the system will work.

[hils.livejournal.com]

Sounds like it's working out so far :)

[notsowise-sage.livejournal.com]

I agree, I don't like the new Ruby. She's not nearly as gorgeous, and she's lost that playful malevolence that was quite fun, also her intensity.

Though, is it me - or was she really actually doing whatever Sam says? Dean noticed it... can Sam control her? What's her name from the big gifted children bust up Azaziel organised could order some demons around - and her and Sam had similar powers to start off with.

Maybe Ruby is Sam's bitch?

[hils.livejournal.com]

She's probably a bit scared of him since he has the power to send her back to hell if he wants to

[notsowise-sage.livejournal.com]

I disagree, I honestly do believe he is an angel of the lord (I had some doubts to start off with). He is Cassiel, for all the importance that will play, I have no doubts about it now. He is God's recorder, he watches - usually he only comes close to earth at the death of a kings and great men of history.

If Morning Star is about to break out of his confinement, then I would imagine that the rules have changed, to a degree. Castiel therefore is given the duty of preparing the Holy sides ultimate weapon, a human warrior, of a legacy of warriors, wise to the world, and to the ways of evil - to counter a human warrior, of a legacy of warriors, wise to the world, and the ways of good. Dean is not only in the attention and thoughts of God, but he is gods only hope of winning the war, without bringing himself to interfere (upon doing so he would have to destroy lucifer, and the consequences would be dire). Cassiel is not a warrior, but he does know everything that has happened, and has been monitoring it for eternity. I think that's what the time travel bit was about, he allowed Dean to see into the past, to share the limits of his knowledge on this specific matter. I'm also presuming that it is Cassiel that choose Dean, and not God himself. Cassiel would have been well aware of what the boys had been up to, and has made the decision that the only person that can ultimately stop Sam is Dean.

The only thing that would make me doubt, would be the fact that he's not been disparaging of humans. Angels are generally considered to be envious of the love God shows humans, even the ones that didn't side with Lucifer. That said, most of what we know of Angels was written 1500 years ago, with some follow up work done in Elizabethan times by the likes of Dee (though generally speaking you can't count it as authoritative - it is however relevant as Supernatural have used similar sources from that period), things may have changed, he's been watching for a long time after all.

Anyway, back to the episode. I actually do believe Sam means what he says, and I'm sure it'll be a couple of episodes before he breaks. As Sam points out he's dealing with some pretty heavy shit, he has the blood of a demon in him. However, his reaction to finding out what Castiel said, and the idea that God has noted Sam, and disapproves to the point he'd have Sam killed really got to him. His entire body language, what he said - it hit him hard.

What Ruby will say, I don't know. I'm not sure what she can say really. What will break Sam is coming across a situation he can't deal with anyother way. Most likely Dean, or Bobby at the mercy of a demon - and the only thing he can do is use his power.

I suspect there's also an addictive nature to these powers, aside from the principle of power corrupts (which isn't exactly accurate historically, the process of achieving power, is the corruptor really - as Barrington Moore insightfully points out), akin to the Dark Side in Star Wars. How can you ignore the power at your disposal? Even if you know it leads to evil, you can't resist using it for good, to save people. The road to hell is paved with good intentions after all. Gandalf couldn't touch the ring in Lord of the Rings, because he knew the power of desire that would come about. He would use it only to do good, until doing something good required him to cross the line.

It's the same problem with politicians, and would be leaders - Sam now has the impossible task of knowing he has the power, but knowing if he uses it, he'll be lost to the power. He was fine in ignorance, now it's another ball game.

[hils.livejournal.com]

A very impressively long comment. Sadly it is late and I think I'll need to read it again tomorrow when I'm less tired. Currently The Magic Roundabout theme is playing in my head as the words wash over me ;)

[hils.livejournal.com]

Absolutely! I've enjoyed all the season and Season 1 is still my favourite but this story arc is really gripping me

[bogwitch.livejournal.com]

>>am I the only one amused that Dean now calls Castiel 'Cass'.

No. It's just you and everyone else that's reviewed it. ;)

[hils.livejournal.com]

Heh! YAY! See, I'm almost part of the fandom *g*

[blisstasteful.livejournal.com]

I think we all know where I stand on the Castiel front.

DEVIIIIIIILLLL!

[hils.livejournal.com]

I am kind of leaning towards that idea...

[blisstasteful.livejournal.com]

If anyone asks I recruited you. LOL!

I'm becoming seriously over invested in the idea

[hils.livejournal.com]

Maybe you should make badges ;)

[blisstasteful.livejournal.com]

I really wish I had the skills to photoshop horns, a pointy beard and a pitchfork onto a pic of him. Maybe I'll just use ms paint

[hils.livejournal.com]

Heh! That'll work. It'll probably look funnier with them just drawn on anyway

[rockgoddes.livejournal.com]

Meep, I posted my comment to the wrong thing, sorry if you get this twice...

I don't trust Castiel either; it can't be as simple as "Angel Of The Lord". He's up to no good.

I also don't think Sam's done with his powers yet either. He may WANT to be, and he certainly LOOKED like he wants to be, but I don't think it's going to be that easy.

There's such a huge trust issue now between the boys...it's going to be an incredibly interesting year for sure!

[hils.livejournal.com]

Hee! It's ok. I'm sure Sage will be pleased somone other than me replied to his long-ass comment ;)

[jacqui-hw.livejournal.com]

I think Castiel is an angel (and doing exactly what he says), if only because Supernatural is never as clever and involved as the people watching would like it to be.

Has there ever been a major plot twist? Has something ever happened five episodes later that surprised you? What you see is what you get with Supernatural.

I thought in the first episode that he might be lying but now I think that would be giving the writers too much credit. I do love Supernatural but it's not something with layers or something that hides important things from you.

[hils.livejournal.com]

You might have a point there actually